What's going on moon gang, the interview you're about to listen to is with kevin pafrath, better known as meet kevin. Now, throughout the interview we talked about quite a bit, we talked about government corruption. What's going on, in california, we talked about inflation, his ideas on the best way to play the next market cycle. We talked about his amc position and what that might become in the future.

He does have some options at play currently, but, most importantly, we talked about what in the world is going on with his hair. I hope that you enjoy, what's going on kevin, very, very excited to be able to speak with you, and i know, ape nation are very excited at what we're about to get into um. First of all, thank you so much for your time. Uh, i have i've, been doing some research on you and, if i'm going to be completely honest, i've been tracking you on youtube for a while and then when i was doing a deep dive, you seem to be an entrepreneur through and through correct me.

If i'm wrong, but it started off with a real estate empire that turned into a very dominant youtube and now most recently it's a stock portfolio that, i would argue, is going to make a grown man cry. So with all of that being said, could you tell us a little bit about what's going on with your hair, yeah yeah, absolutely wow um, that's an incredible intro! Thank you for that uh. You know so the hair is really like a protest, because i spent this three or four months. Uh this summer, uh running a gubernatorial campaign in california and every interview i had every conversation every newspaper i always felt like every little thing i said i was they were just looking.

They were just looking for something like. Ah, you screwed up and, and so the green hair is like a protest to all that out there, man, like i'm so tired of being perfect dogs, i'm like no take the suit off and f that politics sucks. I like it. I like with that.

How long is it going to be there for like how long does that die last whenever it grows out geez, could you tell us a little bit more about the gubernatorial run like what you learned, because i'm sure it had to be eye-opening in the sense of Potentially, learning a little bit more about politics being a bit more dirty or messed up than maybe any of us even knew yeah, it's very dirty, uh way more than i even knew. I think the best example i could give you is, after of course, after but after the election i had uh some top reporters reach out from off the record from different news agencies that are very popular in california uh, the number one and the number three uh Stations in certain areas, i don't want to give away what areas, but but really big stations. Uh reporters reached out. One of them actually met me for coffee because they just want to be totally off the record and they said i could talk about this.

Just can't identify who they are, so it's not like you're, giving away secrets. They want the world to know this and they said they're so frustrated because they would put together reports on the election and they would have somewhere from the corporate level. Somebody come in and edit their reports and their transcripts or whatever they're supposed to read, and then they were told do not change it back. Even if you don't agree with it, read it the way it is, and so one of the examples they gave was they.

They would read things on the air. There is no prominent democrat running against uh, the democratic governor in california and meanwhile, here i am i i i'm a registered democrat. I was registered as a democrat since 18.. I know 50 of people are like.

Ah, he's a democrat like i consider myself so in the middle, i hate the label and honestly i've gotten very pissed off with the democratic party uh. Lately i i hate it all, but with that they would run those labels like there's no prominent democrat running. Meanwhile, i in some polls i was the top replacement to replace the governor and they refused to mention me, and so these uh, the reporters were saying kevin. That was all by design.

Gavin newsom gets them views, gavin, newsom and them have a thing. Together. We throw softball questions at gavin newsom the governor, because if we ever ask him hard questions, we'll get a phone call the next day going hey we're, not doing interviews with you anymore. Then our views go down because we don't get the interview, so we have to cater to the existing politician with softball questions, because he's most likely to stay in and uh he's going to keep getting us views and we get paid based off views is what the Reporters would tell me so they would get blatantly censored on their stories.

Uh, for example. One very briefly, was a reporter wanted to report on the fact that u-haul trucks were unavailable at certain stations in california, because everybody's taking them one way out of california and not bringing them back, yeah and and the uh manager uh the desk manager. For this news station said we're not covering that you're not running that story, because it makes california look bad during an election cycle, and it's just like that's that censorship is real, and so, if there's anything that really blew my mind, it's that the game's pretty well Rigged uh, it's it's uh, you know. Initially, when i got in, i announced my candidacy.

My facebook post, announcing my candidacy, my instagram post got deleted. I thought okay, maybe benefit of that. Maybe it's a fluke. Maybe it's a fluke that i meet all the requirements to get verified on twitter and i don't get verified on twitter.

Maybe it's a fluke that cnn blatantly lied about our campaign and we had to have an attorney: send them a cease and desist letter because they're censoring us, maybe it's all a fluke, but after the election, when i hear these things from insiders, i'm like no. It's rigged yeah. I mean even that word alone, my audience right now. Their ears are perking up because that's exactly the crusade that we've been on and it's a little bit different.

But it's it's disheartening in the general sense that it's one of those things that you assume, whether it's from books, hollywood, just whatever our general feeling of how it seems like we're, lied to by media time and time again. But it's completely different to kind of get inside of it. So in my own experience with the market right now, it's like yeah, i get it it's messed up, but now day over day, that me commenting on financial happenings and media has become literally just vital. To my life and it's what i do just these stories all day: corporate corruption, market manipulation, insider trading, i'm not sure if you were paying attention nvidia, but a new all-time high pelosi is raking in money on those trades.

Now i'm a fan of nvidia. I have no issue with it, but it's that same exact pattern of time and time again the people who are on that inside crowd with money power influence they are making a killing and if there's anything at all, that threatens that status quo like they just try To go scorched earth on it and they completely erase it that that u-haul story is absolutely insane about that. So could you give us a little idea? I mean i'm not in i'm on the opposite coast of you. What's going on in california right now, i'm reading some reports of increased homelessness.

I'm reading things that gasoline, i think, is the highest it's been since 2012 and just in general, i know america's facing inflation. I know there's supply chain issues, especially the la long beach ports out. There give us a little insight to california right now, totally well, geez, first uh yeah. I totally echo your sentiments on how frustrating it, especially in the market.

It's very similar to politics. Like you, said the insider trading, it's almost all the same crowd like you say, but uh yeah, california, look! I live in ventura california, so i feel fortunate that i'm kind of in this this space between santa barbara and la, where we're fortunate in this small kind of like surfer town, it's 110, 000 folks uh and we don't have as much homelessness. But as soon as you go to la it's horrible, i mean it's tent city after tent city uh, it's impossible to get permits out here. Well, you're waiting, eight to 12 months to get permits on basic things like moving a non-bearing wall.

Putting in a window they will shut your job site down on real estate renovations for six to twelve months. I know because i experience it. People are quitting the city staff, they don't pay the city staff enough money, so we can't get anything processed. So we can't build so housing prices are through the roof.

We can't get new developments done because nobody wants new developments in their backyard. The government thinks oh well well, like here's. Here's just an example. You put the politics in how stupid they are.

The government, uh or california legislature said you know what let's pass a bill that lets us turn single-family lots into 10 units. If, if people want so, they can apply to pull permits and tear down a single family and put 10 units there. Well, the state says that and all the the media organizations that support them out here, the liberal media they're like oh, this is so great we're going to be able to have so much more housing, denser housing, where we need it. A lot of people don't like that by the way they like single-family homes, but whatever turns out in the bill itself, they actually have a thing that says: uh.

You can put 10 on a lot if your city passes a bill allowing that no it's kind of like here's, a law. If your city passes a new law, it's totally moronic, like the government, doesn't know what the hell they're doing out here. They're total idiots. It's it's.

I don't know if they're bought out they're, corrupt they're, just morons or stupid, or what it is. It's a very, very broken system. I had my taste of it and it's very disgusting uh. I don't like it.

I mean it's the same thing as like. Listen to this one here here. This tells you everything, governor newsome, signed this bill. I think it was sp, seven or six.

I can't remember what it was. It doesn't matter, but it was. He signed it on this google campus. It was uh a housing bill.

It was supposed to make housing more efficient and uh housing development more efficient, to streamline some of the processes to finally make things faster. So you i read the bill, i pull up the bill and it says uh any project worth over 10 million dollars can apply to have the development process sped up. So immediately. I'm thinking myself, okay great so only rich developers are going to benefit from this bill, but the only way they can actually benefit from that speed up or that sped up process is if they apply through the governor's office.

So it's not through your local office. No, no! No, if you're rich, come to the governor's office and we'll help you out we'll get you sped up like the corruption is literally written into law. You can't make this stuff up, and it's that stuff, that if you don't laugh at it, i feel like you'd end up crying because most of the time they tried to argue like. Why is the general populace so mad like what what's going on like it's they're in a certain sense like looking down in in dazed and confused at from their ivory tower like we don't we don't even get what's wrong right now, it's like that.

Just shows how disconnected they are and - and it's that part that, especially in my little realm of the market, it's this - they have the fancy pedigree on their wall. They they know. What's right, you can't say anything. We know what's right, you're wrong, shut up, sit down, and it's like, if you just bring up a legitimate thing, obviously you're very plugged into the politics of california real estate, the markets, it's the same thing time and time again, where it's just like.

No, if you're this average person, the system is obviously tilted uh, you use the word rig. I would definitely echo that once again and my personal amazement is they're just like we don't even get why you're mad like. Why would you be mad, and it's just like it is it's almost childish and it's more offensive to a certain point that you're like seriously like you, don't get. Why we're mad right now and i think that's uh, the general discontent that so many people have bingo you've nailed it and i mean look people just frustr are so frustrated in california and it makes sense because you pay some of the highest taxes in the state.

Yet you know we're ranked 40th in schools out here, yet we pay we're with new york, we're the top two income uh tax states of the country. We are the biggest state of the country, we're the fifth largest economy in the world like if you took california and sliced out where the fifth largest economy of the world, we should be focusing on how to beat germany who's, the fourth largest economy, but instead we're In the bottom 20 percent of schools - and we can't get homeless people off the street dude we, the governor, says we have a gun, violence, epidemic and more people die to homelessness on our streets than people died at guns in california. It's so broken. You touch anything man, water fires, it's all broken the governor says.

Oh we're going to do all this fire prevention, the guy overstated how much fire prevention they were going to do by 680 percent. It took a left-leaning organization, npr to expose them and then after they get exposed by npr, they they start they. These emails leaked. I think it was through foia freedom of information act.

Uh there were emails that were exchanged hey. We should really change the website about our original promise. Wow, you know not a day passes that you don't get insane developments like that one of the hot ones right now that over the past i don't know a couple days - is inflation and supply chain issues, and i was reading some absurd uptick in the amount of Companies in their earnings reports that are saying supply, chain issues, supply chain issues, inflation, yada, yada, right now, directly related to inflation. Inflation is the federal reserve and it sounds like there's a chance.

We might be getting a new chairman chairwoman. I should really say what are your thoughts on that scenario? Do you think we are going to have a new one? Do you think they're really different at all i mean both are pretty dovish. Do you think it's good bad? Do you think we're going to even see a change yeah, it's going to be really interesting, so uh the wall street journal's editorial board did a piece on this today. I actually have it right here, and it just shows you how extreme it's gotten, because look at this, the wall street journal's editorial board, goes and says here.

The fed's professed inflation target is 2, but the cpi rose 6.2 in october by any measure. This is a historic failure and that powell's credibility has been damaged with his persistent refrain that this is transitory, which has clearly been a bust uh and they just railed on on powell and they're, basically saying if we get brainard uh. The other tentative option right now biden's basically just going to be uh accepting all of this inflation, because she's expected to do exactly the same thing as powell she's just as much of a dove as power. Both of them are on the same boat.

Inflation is transitory. It's going away now in the last fed meeting they mentioned that hey, you know, there's been some confusion with how we're communicating we don't mean transitory to be temporary, we mean we're in a transition, so this is where, like i'm, i'm like 70 30 - maybe 75 25. I believe that at some point in the future, i don't know how long maybe next summer, maybe the end of next year - maybe 2023 inflation will start ticking down. It won't be gone.

It's going to take a while for inflation to go away, but at some point it's going to start ticking down. I believe that, but in between now and then there's going to be a lot of inflation, prices are going to go up like crazy and they already are. We see that so i'm trying to balance my portfolio where i have uh exposure to both real estate and stocks, because i see real estate as my inflation hedge. So if the fed's totally wrong, which which probably about 50 60 percent of people, think the fed's totally wrong, they're dumb like if we're going into hyperinflation right and we're going back to the 1970s, if that's the case, real estate is going to do amazing because rents Skyrocket, real estate prices will be hurt in the short term because rates go up real estate prices go down so do not try to speculate on real estate prices because they'll go down with inflation, but rents will go up to such levels and then prices catch up.

But now to higher levels, because prices gone up, so inflation is actually really good for real estate. It's easier for you to pay your debt off, because debt is fixed 30 year, fixed rate mortgage stays the same. You don't get margin called on your debt. So that's my hedge.

I got about 42 of my portfolio in real estate. That's that's sort of. I call that my inflation hedge, it's my long, hedge. I don't trade it.

I don't sell real estate it's too expensive, so i don't really care what prices do in the short term stocks. On the other hand, i'm going long on technology because i believe that tech companies will figure out how to navigate these issues will learn, will honestly become the most efficient companies we've ever seen. Commodity prices are on a 200 year, downtrend uh and so input costs will go down at some point in the future, whether that's in a year or in five years. At some point, they'll go down and companies don't like pain companies, figure out how to become very efficient.

Their employees become more efficient, their machines become more efficient, their supply chains become more efficient. The problems we're facing now are really just, in my opinion, uh problems that are the perfect tools for companies to use to finally force efficiency and margin improvement. To where i think, two, three four years from now we're going to look back and go. Oh my gosh.

We created the most efficient companies the world has ever seen. We had a pandemic where companies were able to fire tens of thousands of workers, then they only hire back the efficient ones. They don't hire back the bad ones right. It's like the perfect excuse to fire people right and that you know not a disc to anyone who didn't get rehired.

I'm just saying that's. You know, from an investor point of view, it's actually great uh terrible for people who got laid off uh and then for uh for an efficiency point of view. Once we get through these supply chain issues, these companies are gon na, be human, efficient and machine and supply chain efficient. You can't bet against these.

These companies, the technology companies, the tesla, the end phase or even the consumer discretionaries, the online ones like etsy. You can't bet against these companies, so i'm long on those long, bullish, yeah i'll trade in the meantime, but uh yeah we're going to continue to have this pain in the next 12 months. This is going to be the big hot topic for the next 12 months. So do you consider those particular technical, like tech base plays to be an actual inflation hedge, because i think there's a lot of people watching right now who are like hey, i'm not in the financial situation, to really get involved in real estate at this moment.

In time, so what would be your suggestion, for maybe someone who has a quote unquote smaller account to like try to battle inflation if they agree that it's a bit more than transitory and before we get into that, i absolutely loved how mid-conference he was changing. The definition of transitory, like he even said, he's like i, don't know why people are like having such an issue with this, but i kind of meant it this way and his definition became as long as it's not permanently forever. It's transitory. It's like dude.

You can't do that. Mid-Conference come on also true. In fact, i'm pretty sure i saw a reference somewhere where somebody's like you know, the bible refers to our lives as a transitory, so maybe they just mean transitory, for our entire life could be, could be no uh but okay, yeah, so so smaller portfolio, hedging against Inflation uh. Well, i definitely uh have to always start with.

If your net worth is under five hundred thousand dollars to a million dollars figure out how to fix your financial situation, so you can qualify for real estate. There's there's no reason you should be able to qualify for real estate uh if you can't qualify for real estate. That means you have too much debt, in which case you should be getting out of that debt, that consumer debt, credit card debt card debt, right monthly payment debt get out of that uh and number two. You should be figuring out how to increase your income.

That can mean figuring out how to provide more value to society. So learn how to do photography. Videography get a real estate license. Uh coding, uh become a lender, become a cpa.

Uh become you could get a serious 65 license very easily and go work for uh. For a money manager in new york, you know i i had somebody come up to me. They're, like kevin. I was working minimum wage and and three years ago, uh you.

You inspired me to try to learn something. So i ended up learning business analysis. I don't remember the exact course she took, but she walked up to me, uh at the new york stock exchange outside the new york stock exchange and thanked me, and now she works at uh deutsche bank. She makes like a hundred twenty nine thousand dollars a year.

It's like wow, that's amazing, you know it's new york, so 129, it's not like not! You know it's. Obviously it doesn't go as far as it might somewhere else, but still that's way better than a smaller income, and you know they could go. Buy a house in brooklyn or whatever, which i think they were buying a duplex in brooklyn, or something like that anyway, point is number one to me - is figure out how to get into real estate, because this is a great way to to build your wealth. In a large way, uh with, in my opinion, the least amount of risk, if i were going to try to hedge for inflation.

Well, it's tough tech stocks. I don't think are going to do great if inflation stays high in the short term. The the you know, yields will go up. Future cash flows get discounted it.

It should be bad for tech companies. If inflation sticks around so uh, you have two choices. You can take the the long play and go. That's.

Okay, i'll just keep building my portfolio. I don't need this money for 10 20 years i'll build my portfolio potentially at lower prices. Right now, we're pretty crazy at prices. I think end phase at c tesla.

I think these prices are very, very high right now, so i've increased my cash position a little bit, hoping that we'll see a dip here. Sometimes we talk more about that, but yeah in terms of other inflation plays in the stock market, probably not the best uh to advise on that. Just because i don't really get into some of like the industrial plays with the higher cash flows. Now because they have lower growth, i don't care so much about them.

Uh. You know you could look at manufacturers like um, like one that i really like that, i think has a great valuation is embraer: they manufacture jet planes and business jets are just taking off. Like everybody wants business jets now, there's this company called netjets that does private jet services owned by berkshire hathaway. They had to stop selling hours that people can buy so like they can't take any new customers and they've had a freeze since the summer to april of next year.

That's like a 10-month freeze on new customers, because there's so much private jet demand and they're. Just like, please get us more planes, so so that could be an interesting space. Uh industrials, with these lower valuations that have good growth, but also have potentially a tech element to them where uh embraer is trying to get into ev tolls with a spin-off. That's under their their umbrella still and if they do end up spinning off that's gon na be profits for embraer as well as if they sell that business off or whatever.

So i think there are some plays like that. You know some people say that john deere's, the caterpillars - i just don't know enough about these. I don't actually have any money in embry air because i'm very nervous about like they can't just tomorrow, go let's open a new factory. You see how long it takes for tesla to add a factory in germany i mean it's a pain in the ass uh, so i can only imagine a brazilian company where they have even higher inflation for embraer's brazilian.

I don't know so you know real estate or or just suck it up and stick it through in the tech. What, if someone's listening right now and they're like hey, i have some money: let's use your example of below 500 000 and they are worried about it and what, if they have that money whatever it is, what if someone comes up to them? What are your thoughts on like a gold, etf or even crypto? Let's just say, for an example, someone has a hundred thousand dollars. Do you think it's smarter for them to start learning about real estate? Do something in that or just i mean at this point pretty much buy like say two btc uh or do? Would you like balance it out or what's your thought on gold as a hedge or digital gold, aka bitcoin, or we could even talk about something like ethereum yeah, gold's, not fun for me, uh, i i don't like gold. I think if i were going to go into gold i'd much rather go into like ethereum or bitcoin either of those uh.

I probably stay away from the alt madness. I think that's very roulette speculative uh not to say that there aren't good ones like cardano or solana. You know, there's some really great ones but uh. I would probably try to limit my exposure to those, especially if i were had a portfolio and i wanted to be a little bit more conservative.

You know obviously hashtag not financial advice, but uh yeah. I mean if i was gon na, go for some form of of like gold, essentially like you're, saying, probably a balance between bitcoin ethereum and and maybe throw in like a cardano or solana in there and then have like a diversified portfolio. Maybe do all four of them right: okay, uh! You know maybe 30 30 uh 2020. Something like that right, uh.

Another thing that people can do is uh. They can go into a basket of index funds. So, for example, you could go on m1 finance and do 20 s, p, 500, 20, nasdaq, russell and dow er or 25 for each of them, whatever that that's nice, because if we have a market crash, what like a market crash is gon na be what like A seven percent sell-off on those indices and we're all gon na be freaking out of a market crash, because tech stocks are gon na, be down 40 yeah. You know what i mean yeah, so it's a great way to kind of break the glass and then go from from that kind of balance of an index fund pie into individual stocks.

That's an option uh! I would still prefer getting into real estate. I don't want to beat that so much, but uh it and the type of real estate that you should get into, and this maybe i'll just briefly explain why i keep bringing that up is i believe you can buy a home. That is in, let's say, a 400 000 neighborhood for three hundred thousand dollars that needs paint carpet. It's got some mildew, maybe a little bit of a roof leak or whatever, and you can usually after you spend money on the fix up.

You can usually increase your net worth between 60 to 120 000 by not selling, and that's because what what you're doing is you're solving a problem that a lot of buyers don't want to solve. They don't want to deal with. Oh, i got to do a roof or i got a paint or i got to do carpet or it's stinky or it's moldy or it's gross or there's fresh. A lot of these things are very inexpensive to deal with, especially if you can put your own blood.

Sweat and tears in you can do your own painting come on man. You can save so much freaking money so uh to me. That is a way for you to explode your net worth quickly. You know our first house we bought for three hundred five thousand dollars.

We put down collectively eighteen thousand dollars. We borrowed the money from the bank to fix up the property about fifty thousand dollars and uh that that money uh within a year was worth somewhere around a hundred twenty five thousand dollars uh. After all, the fix up and everything like our net worth, ballooned from 18k, collectively to 125 150 000, and we we couldn't have gotten that balloon if it weren't for the fact that we were able to buy a fixer-upper for three and a half percent down. You know yeah i mean, but even with that, i i feel so much is changing with technology right now and, for example, we i'm sure you've read that story of someone 400 plus days ago about 8 000 worth of sheep, and now the wallet's worth like 5.6 Billion, do you feel like at a certain point things that fundamental view? Because of technology and how widespread it is, because everyone has all the apps on their phone and like it feels like things are just getting so much faster and the opportunities are so much more vast, so much more volatile.

Do you think how? I guess we view of classic fundamental things because before, if you were a broker, you got in this index fund and now people are just saying hey. I want to buy amc and jimmy on robin hood, because i can - and i hear it's going to make - i guess hedge funds have a bad day or even with this real estate. These opportunities, i mean i've, run into people that the money they're making off of ra or ethereum bitcoin solano cardano, all of those to them it's like well. All i had to do was hit by on my phone and then i forgot about it, and i came back a couple months later and i didn't have to go through the hassle of even learning about real estate or things like that.

Do you think that that's like a new trend or do you think this is a fad, or do you think, because of technology that like who knows like the the world of investing and, let's say generating wealth? Do you think it's kind of changing for like a permanent nature? Oh yeah? Oh, oh, absolutely, and we've even seen this year, things get faster and faster. Like uh, you know gamestop at the beginning of the year, uh even workhorse at the beginning of the year. These had momentum for a while, i mean you had like you had a i mean. Gme was moving a couple months and that's a while in the momentum game right and then it even held on quite a while to a lot of its value.

It's not forty dollars anymore right. It's held on to a lot of its value because you get a lot of hodlers similar with amc. You had like a good good run for for amc of a lot of enthusiasm and you still have a lot of people hodling. I still huddle my shares, you know and um that uh that's great for gme and amc, but what's transitioned this latter half of the year that i've noticed uh is the momentum plays, are getting shorter and shorter and shorter, like the donald trump's back was hot for, Like three days and then it's dead, the rivian thing was hot for like four days, and now it's on that cool down phase right, uh, meta materials, uh new egg was hot for like a day and then it evaporated right these these opportunities, these momentum movements are, Are going up and coming down so quickly, you're right things are getting way faster and uh.

On the other hand, it also puts to shame some fundamental analysis, because you could do some great fundamental analysis, but if the stock isn't sexy, it doesn't move. It's not true. It's very sad like there are some great companies out there, but if like, if it's here's, here's a theory i have. I have a theory that we are doing something i call concentrating wealth or concentrating into stocks.

I had a picture here somewhere and what i mean by that is, i feel like 10 years ago, you you everybody. There was no real social media pushing stocks 10 years ago, so people were very diversified. Investing into all these different companies. Now i feel like there's more money chasing fewer stocks, because fewer stocks are really the ones that are being talked about on social media, and i think that is enhancing the returns of those stocks.

And then people like to invest in things that are going up. They don't like investing in things that are sideways or down, so you get more money flowing into those. So you really have like a highlighter uh of sexy stocks and and then everything else could be fundamentally could fundamentally look cheap, but it just doesn't move. So you got ta, and this is the hard part you kind of got ta find stocks that fund them have really good fundamentals if you're gon na buy and huddle them and are sexy, that's tough, yeah and that it one of the most interesting things for me Is i've had like that front row seat to the insanity of social media and when whatever it is virality for whatever reason decides to support stock xyz? We see this right now, actively amc gamestop, i mean the social media between twitter reddit everything youtube like the videos that talk about it.

It's just absolutely ridiculous and i would pay any amount of money to have some sort of microphone in a classic hedge fund thing, because what could be going on there like they have to be losing their mind. And you even see a little bit of mainstream media. They're, like yeah no they're buying the stock. Like that's the roaring kitty thing i just like the stock and that's what they do and they buy more and they buy more and they buy more, and i feel like these fundamental models of what they used to base things on they're, just ripping them up, because I get it, i get why a lot of fundamental breakdowns told people they should short.

These stocks, like they're, like hey, no like whether it's the pandemic they're not going to have revenue they're going to short, that's what their models told them and they never ever accounted for the social aspect of people like nah. We don't want you to short that and then they go absolutely hog wild with it, and it's led to honestly this conversation right now because for me it's what gave me this channel and i started to talk about it and it's just pure insanity and it's one Of those things, i always think of the the game of thrones, quote of just that little, the i think his name's littlefinger of just like the the rungs up in chaos. You have so many people and you see it on reddit, especially wall street bets. So the amount of money people take on these yolo bets that any fundamental investor would be ripping their hair out someone's like yeah, i made a couple million off ten thousand you're like what is going on right now and as it spreads more and the digital community Gets bigger and bigger, i don't think this slows down.

I don't think this type of, i guess mantra of just people making social decisions more than the fundamental. I think it comes in and that's the unique thing when you have social and fundamental those are the power plays like those are. Definitely the power plays yeah. I mean look, look at rivian just for an example.

It's it's like you, you get this insane run up, and, and so you can create this - a fundamental value which, which i think is maybe 60 bucks or something like that and anything above that is like social or got ta. Have it right, uh and uh you you, you get these crazy momentum, move ups or run-ups, where the thing runs like 180 and people are posting. These one-week call option returns where it's like. I'm up, two thousand three thousand percent right and those are getting.

These crazy highlights uh yeah. There are opportunities where, if you're early enough and you buy short-term calls on them totally, you can make a killing. You also make a killing on the back end. Once you hit once you crest, you know what happens to momentum.

Just buy some puts and watch it go down, they all go down uh and so it's uh. Unfortunately, i think one of the one of the risk factors is uh trading requires timing. The market really twice it's time in the market getting in and timing getting out and you're really, if you're not really paying attention and you're getting into momentum movers, you could get killed very quickly, but it's a fun game to play and yeah there's money to be Made there so it's it's fascinating and uh hey, you know. If i i encourage it for a small portion of people's portfolio.

You know real estate, long tech and then have some fun too, but but i generally say keep keep that on the smaller side and that's fair because, like you said it is so volatile. But going off of that. I'm just curious about your own psychology. To my understanding off your social media, you made a very good trade on rivian.

Lately you saw the momentum start to die out. You knew that the ipo the car got in front of the horse and you took a nice put play, i believe, you're in it. A couple days, a handful of days, not even and the money you made on it, i'm assuming, is probably more than the appreciation of some of your properties over a couple years. How do you balance that out in your mind of like i made this money in a couple trading days opposed to and i get it it's um the risk reward set up real estate.

It seems to be less risk and you're not going to get a huge multi-thousand percent gain in a couple days. Is that why you like to get that diversity in there you're like a couple of these, plays a couple? Is that your whole thing of like i want the entire spectrum of risk and reward? Is that how you kind of balance it out uh? Well, i mean i can't say i want the whole spectrum, because i don't want bonds uh. Look! I'm! If you look at my portfolio, it's it's tech and it's real estate. So even though i think that's diversified, i'm not diversified in stocks.

You know when you just look at my stock portfolio. It's like 40 tesla right uh. It's it's not very diversified at all uh! So uh i would say well, first of all, i never compare real estate to stocks because it probably make me very sad about having to drive to properties multiple times or you know whatever and and like. Oh, let's put the 20 light fixture in instead of the 29 light fixture and you're right here it is, you know, in like 48 hours, here's a 250 000 investment that that you know made whatever it was 120 000 or something like that.

It's like, oh i'll, take profits on that really quickly. You know. That's amazing, like you're right. 120.

000, like it would take me six months of hell to make that and to flip it in real estate, and i don't even know if you could make 120 grand on a flip. Unless you were doing some like three million dollar property and you scored big. But then you'd spend two years on it. You know that like yeah, so i can't think that way.

Uh, but the way i look at my real estate is uh. I kind of just wan na buy as much as i can, and the reason for that is. I don't care about the cash flow, because cash flows taxed heavily, so are short-term trades they're taxed heavily, don't really care. What i care about is that total value of real estate and over time, knowing that real estate appreciates and historically has a little bit above what inflation is, and then i do that with what i consider very safe leverage.

I've got 58 debt on my properties, and so i get a nice leverage return. I uh can never be margin called on those the rents pay for the debt. The properties are piggy banks for me. So when the market crashes, like it did in march of uh 2020, i went to at the time the eight properties i had.

I broke the piggy bank. I uh took two million dollars out by refinancing i refinanced, starting on march 3rd. I refinanced because the fed was panicking. I'm, like oh rates, just went to zero refinance everything.

It took. Two million bucks at the end of march threw it literally all into the stock market and that exploded. I mean that was the best time to do that. So my real estate really became this.

This like opportunity treasure chest that i could just go to and break the piggy bank so to speak by taking debt out and that's not taxable either when you take debt out, which is wonderful but really the the big value that i see in it, too is So i've got about 23, 24 million or whatever in in real estate, uh and and maybe 12 12 13 or whatever of that is, is debt. I can't remember exactly what the numbers are whatever uh and so the way i look at it is 24 million dollars. If the market appreciates just three percent above inflation, that's uh, 720, 000 of real wealth that i've created above inflation doing nothing. 720, that's nuts! I mean, even even if it was just one percent.

Above inflation, that's 240 grand a year of wealth. That's just you know! Going into this pot basically uh and it's it's easy. It's simple. I know the formula i know how to do it.

I love it and uh. It makes me feel like. Maybe it's just a way of justifying why i'm so heavy in tech? I don't know, maybe that's my psychological justification, you know, but i couldn't be 100 all in a tech, because i probably lose my mind. You know when the market was crashing in march or even even may of 2021.

You know tesla's going down 40 like in two weeks. You know, that's stressful, you look at your real estate and you look at the real estate prices like well. They went up 0.1 percent this week. You know a little bit easier so well, even in those swings and generating immense wealth um.

So my social media stocking of you to my understanding. You basically have a six-figure investment right now in amc. Can you tell us a little bit of thoughts of really what's going on of like what got you interested in it like the insanity of the social group behind it and just right now, obviously, you've still been hoddling it. So why are you still huddling it? Oh well, i promised i would i did promise.

I would also uh, let's see here's, what i've done uh here, i'll, just pull it up real quick. So here's what i got uh amc, i'm down. 13. I so i'm a little under uh six figures right at 2100 shares and i do have two sold puts on it, so i'm actually willing to buy more if it sells below that that's 39 and 40..

I also got those when volatility was was uh. Super super high, so i think that's why one's up you know eight grand and the other one's up, six grand or whatever so um yeah. I think it's you know, i i mean i want to be part of the movement because i support uh, especially after the election. My my failed election.

I support this move for transparency, uh and i think the more attention we bring to what happened with gme and robinhood and amc. The more people like gary gensler pay attention to us that whole sec report, whether we think parts of it or bs or not, doesn't matter so much. What matters is they're talking about us, so i think floyd mayweather said it and he said it well. He talked he said to all the media in front of him.

He goes. I don't care, if you say good things or bad things about me as long as you're talking about me and i think it's the same of of amc, i don't care if you don't like the valuation of amc. I support the movement uh and i i think it's wonderful, so you know that to me is, is why i'm in it, i love going to amc and purposefully over spending on it, like just purposely buy extra like i feel like when i was a kid i'd. Sneak in candy or or alcohol or whatever now, i'm like i'll, take a my tie and you look at the receipt and it's forty dollars from my time, you're like, but i'm a stock owner.

I love that. I absolutely love that, and i i want to take one quick second, because i don't want you to get attacked um they're, to see that you have amc puts folks just you know he sold them. So that means, if it goes in the money, he'll gain more stock. I don't want you to think in any way he's betting against it.

Please just look into the fact that he sold puts it's very different than buying puts just. We need to get that on record because i think there's some people who might be a little new to options are like whoa whoa. What's going on here, you see the word put yeah exactly so. Basically, if amc falls below 39 or below uh dollars by january of 2022 and 2023, i will be forced to buy an additional 2 000 shares in each of those januaries.

So that's the commitment i made to actually double or triple my portfolio and exposure to amc. Yeah, we definitely need to get that clarification out there, so in the market right now, just rewinding a little bit to our earlier conversation. Are you seeing a dip looming in the next? I don't know. Let's say one two: three months like are your concerns of inflation, that serious that the party might be over pretty soon or what are you seeing in like what you would define as your short to almost medium term? I definitely see very frothy valuations.

I think we we ran very very quickly in the last month to where i uh, i paid off all my margin, and now i am about 8.8 cash. I think, as of today, usually i want to be fully invested now, uh. There are also some other things. I might want to put cash into whether that's uh, you know, maybe buying an apartment, building or whatever by the end of the year, to save some money in taxes or whatever, but at the same time i'm also i've got the cash there.

So if there's a big dip in the market, then screw the property i'll just go, buy the big dip like i'd love to buy nvidia, but i'm not going to buy it at 320 uh, you know. Is it gon na go to 400 one day? Of course uh am i maybe gon na miss the boat fine, but we're just in this market right now, where it's so euphoric. I just can't feel good about adding to it right now, so i've actually been going through uh i've uh i've gotten out of some trades like um, i'm almost completely out of insurer tech, uh i've taken some profits on some things: small losses on some things, just To build cash so that if we have a dip i'll buy the opportunity if we don't have a dip whatever that means 92 percent of my portfolio is going to the moon. How can i be upset with that? I'm just cracking up because i'm honestly picturing nancy pelosi just watching this interview and she's like all right, nvidia to 400.

Let me get some call options on that. One she's, like all right, send this off yeah thinking of pelosi and politicians and your little. I guess connection to politics. Now, one of the biggest things of the apes is trying to get changed to like really trying to get some of these legitimate issues in the market.

The extreme amount of off exchange trading, the poor reporting for fails to deliver the fact that shorts aren't reported uh pattern day trading. A lot of things were pitched at were pitched the fact that it's a free market and then you start playing in the game you're. Like well, hang on, it seems like not everyone's traded free in your own assumption. What's actually the best way to get the attention of someone like gary gensler scc, other politicians, i try to reach out i'm in pennsylvania.

I try to reach out to the senator um senate finance committee, pat toomey. He happens to be here in pa and i just got the lip service he's like oh yeah, thanks for reaching out. If you have more like reach out again, it's just the automated email, where they just put my like name in it and that's, i think, the frustration of a lot of people's we're, told politicians work for us they're supposed to be working for the betterment of society. Culture and the country, but yet they just don't, listen to us.

So do you have any, i guess at least personal opinions on like okay, we're loud and obviously we get hashtags going we're a force on various forms of social media. But is there like more of a a professional adult way to like the channels to go through to like say, hey, we actually want change for like x, y and z, um, very, very hard uh. I'm gon na answer two questions here. So one is uh.

The the opinion part, my opinion is that we should have instantaneous disclosure with politicians. There shouldn't be a 45-day delay right. This should be instant uh, that that should be the number one thing that happens, and that should be very obvious and simple to do. I you know personally, like let him trade just make him disclose it instantly uh.

The second thing is, i think, the best way to usher in change is it's a hard way, but i think it's the best way is the free market creating a brokerage that provides these additional levels of transparency and then the community using that service. By voting with what the service they want and then all of a sudden, the other brokers have to adapt, and then it trickles up to the regulators uh. That's that's my belief. It's so difficult to get congress to do anything.

I hate the government uh. So i actually have more faith in the free markets, ability to solve that, and then consumers ability to vote for that. So i would say: support uh brokers that which, which honestly so many brokerages just suck right now, uh support the ones that you believe the most. In like, for example, public just as an example, they they publicly say they don't do payment for overflow, hey, maybe open a public account and and uh it put even just a portion of your portfolio there just to be part of that voting mechanism.

Uh, that's uh, but, but hopefully there'll be another in the future. That's even more transparent that you know every day like kathy wood discloses her trades for arc, invest every day, usually at like 5 p.m. California, time all right every day, the broker's like here are the shorts at our brokerage. Today, here's this that happened today, here's whatever right, like that's kind of what we need, so i think we need brokerages to really step up their games.

It's hard for us. I feel like as a community to do that uh other than what we've already done with gamestop uh gamestop. That was incredible. That was really the first time people in media ever even cared about transparency.

I feel like in in you know, uh in finance, so the gamestop situation was was the best. We could ask for yeah the that 45 day thing i was just reading about it. What's really insidious about, it is yes, they have up to 45 days. Many politicians run past it, but then the website it goes on has 45 days to post it.

So there's a chance, even within rules. It could be 90 days three months later and i'm reading this, and then you read about how many of them default on it. Anyway, they're over 45 days and it's a crazy mechanism, because the people who are the watchdogs, the sec, their checks, are signed by the government. So what are we expecting them to bite the hand that feeds them, like literally their funding, comes from the people that they're supposed to enforce? I just don't get it.

The other thing i don't get is i've been following kathy wood for quite a while, and i've seen that she's been loading up on robin hood and i just don't get it do. I haven't been dead on robin hood? Yes, but even if we look at the business, so much of its revenue comes from payment for order flow. The sec gary ganzler is currently looking at that, if they don't the first quarter of this year, they got by on the quarter because of the insanity and gamestop, specifically options trading, the next quarter. It was doge because everyone was going crazy with doge.

That's where it's got its money fast forward to the third quarter, the most recent one well without a crazy event with that many people in exodus from robin hood, it burned 1.3 billion dollars the public hates it. So when you don't have the social support and also you have a failing business model that actually might even be outlawed, what i don't it just hit an all-time high low like low like it is it look like i just don't get it is there? Maybe i'm a little bit too close to this one, but what do you think she's even seeing that she's like oh, i should probably buy this one uh. I think i think the odds, and i think she thinks this as well. I think the odds of payment for order flow ironically going away, are very low uh.

I uh you know we would. We can talk more about what we believe about in that, but i don't think the sec is going to be able to pull off any change there. I wouldn't be surprised if they come out and say something like you know what we looked into payment for order flow uh. You know, there's nothing we're gon na do about it.

I i wouldn't be surprised if they do literally nothing about it, uh, which is also no surprise, because that's government for you. So i think, there's a part where kathy sees this, as maybe a a dip opportunity where it's like hey it's it's sold off because of gme. It's sold off because of uh this the payment for order flow drama and potential uh banning with uh with the sec. But once the gme thing passes and once the payment for order flow thing passes, it'll it'll go back up to the moon.

I believe that's. What is potentially is what she's thinking fundamentally uh. You know the valuation isn't horrible at thirty to forty dollars uh.